Follow the podcast on
Apprehension for a New Zealand-European Union trade deal don't bode well.
The Prime Minister is heading to Brussels tomorrow after Nato meetings in Madrid, and will hold talks with EU trade negotiators.
Despite discussions continuing for roughly four years, there's been no win yet.
Democracy Project international analyst Geoffrey Miller told Heather du Plessis-Allan the rumours around the deal aren't good.
He says the EU just doesn't seem to want to budge on giving New Zealand substantial market access for meat and dairy.